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#96824 - 11/22/09 09:22 AM Shocking story
BK_G Online   content

Self diagnosed aspie.
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Registered: 01/26/05
Posts: 7794
Loc: Duncan BC Canada
This story really shocked me, over various aspects. I'm wondering if anyone here sees the same thing. Please read the story carefully, then compare it to the page 2 photo of the Incident Report.
Article

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#96825 - 11/22/09 11:15 AM Re: Shocking story [Re: BK_G]
v-dog Offline
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Registered: 05/12/05
Posts: 5014
Loc: Earth
If a mother tasered her own child for bring "disorderly" then the mother would go to jail for abusing the child. The mother should be arrested for giving the police "permission" to tase. The fact is that under common law one can not consent to a battery, (See? I can outpun you, mr "Shocking Story smile ) and thus a parent can not offer such consent on behalf of a minor child.

As to the cop: If you can't take on a 10yr old girl without a weapon, you are WAAAAY too much of a sissy to be in law enforcement. Maybe ballet dancing or interior design would be more to your liking.
_________________________
"All your crying don't do no good
Come on up to the house
Come down off the cross, we can use the wood
You gotta come on up to the house"
-Tom Waits - "Come On Up To The House"

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#96842 - 11/22/09 08:01 PM Re: Shocking story [Re: BK_G]
I am not crazy Offline
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Registered: 07/24/09
Posts: 497
Loc: near the casinos, connecticut
I think I see the same thing, it seems as though the girl may have sensory issues and perhaps may fall on the autism spectrum.


"As to the cop: If you can't take on a 10yr old girl without a weapon, you are WAAAAY too much of a sissy to be in law enforcement. Maybe ballet dancing or interior design would be more to your liking"

v-dog would you have prefered the officer put a smack down on her and possibly injure the girl? she was very obviously highly aggressive and a threat to herself and the officer. she had attacked the officer in attempts to injure him.

had the officer "been a man" and not a sissy and forcefully placed her into handcuffs and possibly breaking and arm or leg than there would be a greater outrage. was there another peaceful solution? I dont know, I wasn't there and I dont think anyone here was there either.

was the mom overreacting calling the police, I'd have to say YES but then again I wasn't there and I dont live with that family. I think mom could have and may should have handled it differently and I definately think she over reacted calling the police.

I think the officer may have over done it tazing the girl but she was very aggressive and a threat to self and others and it seems he was alone with no backup. the reason he had none????? I know our police send at least 2 officers to a domestic call, when possible maybe more depending on nature.

I dont know if you have ever been in a situation similiar to that officer, I have been and it sucks. you hope your actions were the right ones and justified but in the heat of the moment you dont have that luxury to be able to think it through.
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"the difference between a successful person and others is not a lack of strength, not a lack of knowledge but rather a lack of will." Vince Lombardi

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#96845 - 11/22/09 08:36 PM Re: Shocking story [Re: I am not crazy]
BK_G Online   content

Self diagnosed aspie.
Member

Registered: 01/26/05
Posts: 7794
Loc: Duncan BC Canada
My sister pointed out that the mother might be completely ignorant of AS or autism and if the girl has that, this isn't going to be the least of her problems. I really hope somebody in the system can at least check for that possibility.
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A smile can be infectious. Let's hope they never find a cure.

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#96855 - 11/23/09 12:56 AM Re: Shocking story [Re: BK_G]
Mom4Max Offline

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Registered: 05/03/05
Posts: 3946
Loc: Northern California
Man, if a mother can't handle her 10 year old daughter without calling the police I agree she has some huge issues to deal with. If I was 10 and some strange man, police man or no was trying to get me into the shower I would fight too, especially if my mom was his accomplice. I also think threatening to arrest her was a completely wrong move. How about telling her they were going to have to take her to the hospital for help if she could not control herself. I think an emergency room would have been a better destination than they jail and the mom or the cop should have gotten medical help for her if she was truly out of control. It does not sound like he even tried to talk to this child, just bully her. Handled badly all around.

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#96860 - 11/23/09 09:44 AM Re: Shocking story [Re: Mom4Max]
v-dog Offline
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Registered: 05/12/05
Posts: 5014
Loc: Earth
IANC - Tasing is potentially fatal. It has never been properly tested on humans - just on pigs (or should I say "swine" to prevent misunderstanding) and a broken arm or leg is very much less so.

The beauty of the taser, despite the fact that it is often lethal to humans, is that it leaves only 2 small marks - and not bruises which can be stunningly photographed.

In Florida recently, the cops tased a 6 year old child who was acting up in school.

If you as a law enforcement officer can't handle the person you want to arrest, call for backup. I'm sure 4 or 6 people could have restrained her without using potentially lethal force.

If you read polica training manuals, as I have, you will find that the least amount of force necessary is what is supposed to be applied, and that Tasers are considered just one step below firearms by most departments.

So I say to the cop: If you feel like too much of a sissy asking for backup to arrest a 10 yr old girl, don't use potentially lethal weapons on her. Don't use a device which is so painful that it is torture. If an arm or a leg gets busted, it will heal, but you can't always bring someone back from an arrhythmia caused by 50k volts.

He needs to be fired immediately and the whole force retrained.
_________________________
"All your crying don't do no good
Come on up to the house
Come down off the cross, we can use the wood
You gotta come on up to the house"
-Tom Waits - "Come On Up To The House"

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#96882 - 11/24/09 01:51 PM Re: Shocking story [Re: v-dog]
I am not crazy Offline
Member

Registered: 07/24/09
Posts: 497
Loc: near the casinos, connecticut
this part I will agree with you on "If you as a law enforcement officer can't handle the person you want to arrest, call for backup. I'm sure 4 or 6 people could have restrained her without using potentially lethal force." I think that the officer may have over reacted by tasing her. I am aware that a tazer is potentially fatal by causing v-fib in RARE circumstances,usually seen in people with underlining cardiac issues. if there was more officers there, perhaps a safer less violent outcome could have been achieved or at least restraining her.

I think the Florida police who tazed that 6 year old should be fired. What in the world would posses and officer to fear for his safety with a 6 year old. unless that kid had a deadly weapon (gun or large knife openned) in his hand so he had to zap him? or if that kid was the built like Mike Tyson.


I am not saying the officer was justified zapping a 10 year old and I am not trying to defend him in that particular case; I feel there may have been other options available but I was not present so I don't have all of the facts. i am defending police when people second guess and play monday morning quarterback when they weren't even present at that particular incident. they don't know what exactly happened or what lead up to it or what was going through the officers minds.


I have been there when the **** hits the fan and it is a very chaotic, hectic and a dynamic scene constantly changing. a very emotionally charged scene with a bunch of irrational and illogical people who refuse to listen to reasoning and common sense. you hope that your actions were the best course of action, based on training and experience. sometimes they make the wrong choice or action and they have to live with it
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"the difference between a successful person and others is not a lack of strength, not a lack of knowledge but rather a lack of will." Vince Lombardi

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#96883 - 11/24/09 02:05 PM Re: Shocking story [Re: I am not crazy]
v-dog Offline
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Registered: 05/12/05
Posts: 5014
Loc: Earth
Originally Posted By: I am not crazy
I was not present so I don't have all of the facts. i am defending police when people second guess and play monday morning quarterback when they weren't even present at that particular incident. they don't know what exactly happened or what lead up to it or what was going through the officers minds.

And there you have it. Just replace the words "police" and "officers" with the words people and people's."

Because that would describe most of what law enforcement does. They make assumptions and then arrest people when they have no personal knowledge of what really happened. Only infractions and misdemeanors must actually be witnessed, and even those rules are being slowly eroded. Most of what cops do is decide on a story they like that seems to fit with what they want to do or how they feel - monday morning quarterbacking - about incidents they have not witnessed.

Why the double standard?
_________________________
"All your crying don't do no good
Come on up to the house
Come down off the cross, we can use the wood
You gotta come on up to the house"
-Tom Waits - "Come On Up To The House"

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#96892 - 11/24/09 05:50 PM Re: Shocking story [Re: v-dog]
johnblackwell Online   content

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Registered: 01/08/07
Posts: 2343
Loc: Fairfax Co. VA USA
True, but they're right often enough to keep society from disintegrating.

To you, nothing imperfect is ever acceptable. The problem with that is that rejecting all imperfection leads to complete chaos.
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John
http://www.caseint.com/john
"I'm not sure of much of anything these days. Maybe that's why I talk so much." Robert Persig - Zen and the art of Motorcycle Maintenance

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#96896 - 11/24/09 07:16 PM Re: Shocking story [Re: johnblackwell]
v-dog Offline
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Registered: 05/12/05
Posts: 5014
Loc: Earth
I would like to see your evidence that they are "right" often enough.

Absent a drunken confession, Cops (the FOX TV show) is full of nothing but bullying and civil rights violations.

At a certain point, the "imperfection" becomes the chaos.

I guess you just don't see that yet. Crack a legal book or two and then watch COPS. You might see it from a different perspective.

Or maybe a few days in jail over an illegal arrest might help your learning curve and change your tolerance for "imperfections."
_________________________
"All your crying don't do no good
Come on up to the house
Come down off the cross, we can use the wood
You gotta come on up to the house"
-Tom Waits - "Come On Up To The House"

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